Hi fsev
Forestry can be sustainable.
The clear cuts that you (and others) have identified are relatively small, suggesting they are part of a managed system. They will almost certainly be replanted.
Even a 'protected' area can allow sustainable management.
A lot of Slovakia (and Czech) was planted with large areas of single species (monoculture) and often non-native species. There has been a big change in forestry practice recently and there is a move to small plots of mixed species. This helps protect against disease (especially bark beetle attacks) and events such as the devastating wind throw in Slovakia in November 2004 (200kph winds, 4.7 million cubic metres of timber destroyed).
http://www.fao.org/regional/SEUR/events/Zvolen/docs/ReportMoA.pdf
http://www.flickr.com/photos/63667026@N00/397732438

Cau

Hi xtaaxt
��is there any original woods in Euro?�� you ask.
In western and central Europe the answer is no.
Before humans arrived Europe would have been largely forested. But almost every piece of land in Europe has now been influenced by human activity, either directly (felling trees) or indirectly (grazing by domesticated animals). In the UK we have �Ancient woodland�, but this is considered to be land continuously wooded since AD1600 (hardly �ancient�, but the wildlife associated with such sites is very important). Other European countries have similar classifications.
So, although there may be an old forest near you it is likely to have undergone many changes throughout history and will not be �original�. Even if the forest has been there for centuries, it�s structure will have changed due to the effects of sheep, cattle, and even deer populations which have been introduced and maintained by humans.
It�s only when you go east that you start to find �original woods�. The forests of eastern Poland are considered as such. They are �primaeval� � almost untouched by human activity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bia%C5%82owieski_National_Park

[Not wanting to change the subject or anything : but I find it incredibly curious how the 'newgrowth' trees around this area are spaced. They are not at all haphazard, but very evenly (albeit irregularly) spaced some 50 to 80 feet between each one. It seems most unlikely to me that new growth would regenerate in this manner. One would expect 'clumps' of vegetation determined by the fall of seeds and happenstance. However these trees look almost as though they were sprinkled evenly about the landscape.

While not wishing to deviate from the topic of this thread per se - I do wonder what makes the trees grow back like this? Far apart and with no shrubbery etc in between?

---

Hi Heamit,
Good question! I read an article in National Geographic about the decline of the Amazon forest. I understand some of the land is cultivated intensively for a few years after which the soil is leached to such an extent that it's only useful for grazing cattle. I imagine during the cultivated period they might leave a few trees here and there for shade (if it was small scale farming). Grazing cattle can't reach higher branches so the trees remain. Does that sound likely?
Evert.

Hi Diane,
Thanks for the reply. Despite what happens in the Dem Republic of Congo, there are quite large and relatively stable parts of the Congo basin (Camaroon, Guinee, Gabon and the other Congo (Brazzaville) where there is hope for sustainable forestry. Large parts of the forests are protected by law - only sustainable forest management (of the original forest) is allowed. I was lucky to be able to visit several logging companies in the area (3 years ago). Some now have an FSC certificate for sustainable forest management of virtualy virgin forest. They harvest about 3 trees of a certain size per hectare and rotate with a frequency of 30 years. In this way the forest ecology undergoes a minimal and temporary distortion. Areas which are ecologically more sensitive or special (elephant or Gorilla hide outs for instance) are exempted from logging. I thought it was pretty impressive. Some of these consessions were about the size of a third of my country. Well maybe that's still small, my country being smaller than most US states. The difference with Brazil is that in Africa most of the forest is governement owned whereas in Brazil it mostly large landowners who do what they want, the laws can't be enforced.

I believe the sustainable use of tropical hardwood could be a sound economic incentive for maintaining tropical forests. If only large consumers (like my own government) decline from using anything but sustainable wood. If you realise that the market value (in US or Europe) of one hardwood tree could be anything up to 10.000 US$, you can work out the rest of the economic picture!

I did'nt realise Haiti has become an ecological disaster area. I'll check it out on GE.
Bye,
Evert.

Hi Evert
I posted this earlier - but maybe didn't link it properly?

''Hi Heamit
This vegetation pattern is almost certainly due to grazing. The individual trees and groups of trees will be tall enough so that their branches are out of reach of grazing animals. Or they may be thorny or unpalatable species. The area between them will be grazed so that trees cannot regenerate.
This can actually be a very sustainable mixture of forestry and agriculture - enough grazing for livestock with trees producing timber, fruit and nuts. The trees can also offer shade for the livestock.''

So I agree that your idea definitely sounds likely. Difficult to tell how sustainable this particular area is - it's quite large.

Hi Evert

''If only large consumers (like my own government) decline from using anything but sustainable wood''

Absolutely true - we have to make sure that we look for the FSC mark when buying any hardwood product:

http://www.fsc.org/en/

Hi diane. My english is very bad but I�ll try it. Yes, it�s a sad place. Compare it with previous years.

Hi erreka
This is great - shows the problem very clearly. Can you give us some details about why this has happened - is it small scale farming or logging? For local produce or export?
Thanks
Imp
P.S. nothing wrong with your English!

Hello Imp.The government built the road Cuiab�-Porto Velho. They finished it in 1960 and it crosses Rondonia. In 1980 the World Bank decided to pave it. The images of 1975 y 1986 show great colonys of immigrants, near the road, in the region of Ariquemes. The "backbones" are the result to cutting the trees to get new lands. Principally, cattle ranches and annual cultivations. Coffee, rubber and cacao, less than 10%.
More info: http://www.mongabay.com/brazil.html

In Matto Grosso, deforestation grows more faster than the rest of the regions: large mono-cultivations of soy (Maggi group, company of the governor of Matto Grosso), looging...

Thanks erreka - interesting info and a good link.
Imp